Orientalism! with Lucien Brentano (Unedited)

Tepic Harlequin: oh,,,,, Mr Baron, Sir, here’s the stuff yer were wantin fer my talk next year!
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Excellent.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach reads and chuckles
The Doctor: Hello, Baronin, Ms. Hienrichs.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach bows
Zantabraxus: Greetings, Callidus
Zantabraxus: Greetings, Ereh, Lynn *smiles
Erehwon: Baronin, it is loely to see you.
Lynn Mimistrobell: Hello Baronin.
Tepic Harlequin: so… how comes yer all gathers round the outdise, when there is this big space in the middle?
The Doctor: Halaa, Mr. Branagh!
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: They are being shy.
Liza eliz: <<is shy
Jimmy Branagh: Hoy awl!
Jimmy Branagh waes
The Doctor: I didn’t realize you were so….young. You decked Mr. Mannonen pretty hard.
Liza eliz: Jimmy Hi
Bookworm Hienrichs chuckles.
Tepic Harlequin: watcha Jimmy!
Bookworm Hienrichs: Hoy, Jimmy!
Lynn Mimistrobell: I will probably need to slip out before the end…
Zantabraxus: Greetings, Jimmy
The Doctor high-fies Mr. Branagh.
Jimmy Branagh joins Tep in the Inner Circle
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: We will hae a transcript posted.
Erehwon: Master Branagh, good to see you!
Tepic Harlequin: ha! most people just slaps him round the back of the head! hehehe
Bookworm Hienrichs: And welcome, Miss Oubliette.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Eeryone, do moe in! If you are inside the maze, you are within hearing range.
Forgetful Oubliette nods
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Yes, don’t be shy! I don’t bite!
Stereo Nacht: Good day Herr Baron, Queen Zantabraxus, Mr. Branagh, Magistrate Marenwolf-Brentano, Ms. Riiera, and eeryone!
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: If anyone needs a chair or a cushion, IM me, bitte.
Lynn Mimistrobell: Oh, pity.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Not sure about some of these others, but nothing entured, nothing gained!
Liza eliz: hi Stereo
Lynn Mimistrobell: Hello Stereo, Liza… Eeryone else that I missed.
Aodhan: 🙂
Liza eliz: Hi Lynn
Erehwon: Captain! Good to see you.
Lynn Mimistrobell smiles.
Aodhan: Yes, hello to eeryone I’e missed.
Liza eliz: <<awes around.. I msut say same as Lynn Hi all I mised greeting
The Doctor: Hello, Captain Nacht, wonderful seeing you again.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Herr Aodhan, Fraulein Riiera – do you need chairs?
Jimmy Branagh: Ah a good crash is so refreshing …
Liza eliz: wb
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Ach, Herr Jimmy.
Jimmy Branagh: Thenks:)
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Crashzundheit!
Bookworm Hienrichs chuckles at Jimmy.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: A good crash really gets the SL blood pumping, eh Jimmy?
Jimmy Branagh: Danke Herr Baron!
Aodhan: I am perfectly happy standing, Baron, and if not, the floor beckons welcomingly. But thank you.
Jimmy Branagh: Yes, just hafta uncross me oyes now …
Aodhan: Riiera, would you like a chair?
Riiera: oh no, thank you ,dear
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach nods
Tepic Harlequin: if the chat’s about the East, don’t we all sit on mats or summit?
Bookworm Hienrichs steps forward, flipping through her notebook.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Heh, good point.
Jimmy Branagh: This chair wos made in East Babbage, Tep!
Aodhan: Yes, when in Rome….!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: We tried that. My pillows are a litte… too informal.
Bookworm Hienrichs: Welcome to this month’s Aether Salon! Today, we celebrate the anniersaries of both the Salon itself, and the city of Mondrago.
Aodhan laughs.
Bookworm Hienrichs: The Salon is starting its seenth season. Who knew, when it first started, that we’d still be gathering so many years later?
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach applauds
The Doctor: Applause!!
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: .
Liza eliz: <<applauds
Jimmy Branagh: Amazin’ Happy Anniersary Salon an’ Mondrago!
Bookworm Hienrichs smiles. “And I thank you all for your support oer those years.”
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Wow, seen seasons? that’s wonderfully amazing.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Only one change of management.
Bookworm Hienrichs nods.
Bookworm Hienrichs: Mondrego is… actually, I’m not sure which anniersary we’re celebrating.
Bookworm Hienrichs chuckles.
Bookworm Hienrichs looks around at the Mondrego residents.
The Doctor: The third since its return from the mists.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: We agreed on three for Mari’Kesh in specific, ja?
Bookworm Hienrichs: Ahh. Well, happy third birthday to it!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: That’s correct. Three years for Mari’Kesh
Bookworm Hienrichs applauds.
Jimmy Branagh applauds
The Doctor: Applause!!
Erehwon: Halaa!
Liza eliz: <<applauds
Lady Sumoku claps
Wulfriðe Blitzen Applauds
The Doctor: Is that correct, Ereh?
Erehwon: It is.
Bookworm Hienrichs: To celebrate both anniersaries, Magistrate Lucien Brentano will treat us to a discussion on the history and forms of Orientalism in European cultures.
The Doctor: Oh, good.
Bookworm Hienrichs: Before we proceed, some housekeeping reminders:
Bookworm Hienrichs: 1) To ensure you can hear the speaker, stand or sit on the patterned carpet.
Jimmy Branagh: Is th’ Doctor gonna play too?
Bookworm Hienrichs: 2) If you do not hae a wearable chair and wish one, please contact Baron Wulfenbach
The Doctor: Huh? oops.
Jimmy Branagh grins
Bookworm Hienrichs: 3) Please remoe all lag-feeding whats-its you might be wearing.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Halaa, my loe!
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: (Ah, Frau Brentano-Marenwolf, sehr gut.
Bookworm Hienrichs: 4) A tip jar is out for our speaker. Do please show your appreciation!
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Good afternoon.
The Doctor: Halaa, Tehanu!
Bookworm Hienrichs: 5) Any tips to help support the establishment will also be welcome – just click on one of the support signs, or on the floating dirigible!
Liza eliz: Already fed him
Erehwon: Halaa, Tehanu and Andrea!
Bookworm Hienrichs: 6) If you’re not a member of the AEther Salon group, there are signs that will let you join up. You’ll be most heartily welcome!
AetherSalon: Me! Up here, please!
Bookworm Hienrichs: 7) Edited and unedited transcripts of these proceedings will be posted at aethersalon.blogspot.com.
Bookworm Hienrichs: And now, to introduce our speaker, here is Baron Klaus Wulfenbach.
Bookworm Hienrichs applauds.
The Doctor: Applause!!
Liza eliz: <<applauds
Zantabraxus applauds
Jimmy Branagh applauds
Aodhan applauds.
Lady Sumoku cheers
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano APPLAUDS!!!
Stereo Nacht: Good day Mr. Blitzen, M.s Marenwolf-Brentano!
Jan: APPLAUSE! 🙂
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Danke for your warm welcome to our guest. Magistrate Brentano has been many things.
Erehwon: Halaa!
Tepic Harlequin: hang on… he’s a Beak?
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Builder, scripter, RFL captain, Knight of Caledon, Priateer – but then he took on the challenge of national management and has stood up well.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Herr Magistrate, the floor is yours.
Jimmy Branagh applauds
Zantabraxus appaluds
Bookworm Hienrichs applauds.
Liza eliz: <<applauds
Stereo Nacht: (Ack. I meant *Ms.* Blitzen, of course! Sorry!)
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach applauds
Wulfriðe Blitzen: Applauds
The Doctor: Applause!!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Thank you ery much, Herr Baron.
Wulfriðe Blitzen grins to Frl. Nacht
Erehwon: Lynn sends her apologies, she had to run.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Halaa and welcome eeryone! It’s an honour to be here today.
Wildstar Beaumont: greetings all
Liza eliz: hello
Jimmy Branagh waes
Aodhan waes.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: (It was good to see her een briefly.)
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: When I was offered the opportunity to present a topic for the Salon, I knew that it would be a perfect opportunity to dele into the (mostly ictorian) concept/moement of Orientalism.
The Doctor: Indeed, indeed!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: While eery culture across the ages has participated in some leel of cultural exchange (the prealence of pyramids and false arch architecture in early Mesoamerica being a shining example), technological adances in “Western” cultures at the end of the 18th Century and accelerating in the 19th Century led to a cultural exchange phenomenon known to us now as “Orientalism.”
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: In order to understand how Orientalism came to be – and why it’s largely seen as a malign chapter in history – we hae to take a look at what was happening in the world during the Age of Western Expansion and Empire.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: At this time in history, the Middle Class (the band of people between the traditional nobility and the labor class) saw a massie explosion in size, power, and affluence. Owing mostly to the dawning of the Industrial Age, this nascent class enjoyed enourmous sociological and economic power. Coupled with the increased leisure time afforded by industrialization, this new group began looking outward from their own lies to explore the world at large – and driing world economies with them. This is the time period of Darwin and his HMS Beagle, of the transformation of “natural philosophers” into the “scientists” of today. The Age of Reason was in full swing. Cargo ships from a hundred nations floated at anchor in the major shipping hubs of Europe.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: This Imperial Import and the increase of leisure time across seeral classes resulted in people looking at these strange and distant lands with a romantic eye, eagerly consuming the imported products of those areas (Particularly Turkey, Egypt, eeryone along the Silk Road, China and Japan) and integrating the exotic spice of those areas into artistic and literary works. For this specific time period, we refer to this as “Orientalism.”
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: While my goal is to discuss the positie aspects of Orientalism, it’s ery important to understand why it’s seen in academic circles as something unsaory.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: If you’ll recall a few moments ago, I used words like “strange” and “exotic” to describe the cultures and artifacts. I also said “romantic,” often enough a good descriptor but in this case it means sort of the opposite. The Europeans – particularly the English – consuming this cultural stream did so from a ery pompous, priileged state. The artifacts were seen as “quaint” and emphasized for their foreignness. “The Orient” as a literary deice was a shortcut for “dark, unciilized place” and the men were almost uniersally twisted, dark, untrustworthy or inscrutable. They were henchmen or illains – always antagonists and neer protagonists. They had alarming and barbarous manners; if they didn’t they were likely a fawning lackey. Women were seen as frail to the point of uselessness – the literal China Doll. The oerwhelming Western European Imperialist iew of eerything “not European” was frequently contemptuous.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: We can see echoes of that today, 150 years later. Howeer, it’s my belief that the interening time has allowed us a measure of self-introspection and blunts a lot of those sharp edges. There are still some issues, yes, but I feel that we’re much better about it now than our forebears.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: (If I’m going a little fast, please let me know)
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: (I’m hoping to hae time for discussion at the end)
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Haing addressed the darker sides of the topic, we can now turn an eye to the ways in which I feel Orientalism helped “Western” culture, the benefits we’e receied – and how we’re playing with Orientalism in constructie ways here in SL.
The Doctor: Perhaps just a peench…but I’m keeping up.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: (I’ll take it down a little bit, then. It’s not a race)
The Doctor: You’re doing great, boss.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: At the beginning of the talk, I said that eery culture has participated in some leel of cultural exchange. This is one of the main characteristics of “culture” – trading the “interesting” bits with other cultures. We hae eidence of trade and cultural exchange reaching back for thousands of years. Bracelets of seashells hae been uncoered in the desert, hundreds of miles from the waters that proided the raw materials.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: To me, this is one of the most powerful aspects of humanity. This constant cross-cultural pollination gies us all the opportunity to see and try new ideas – if they suit, they become part of the culture at large. If not, they are discarded in the course of time. Cultures come into being with a certain cultural package. They add bits from other cultures, they drop bits of culture that don’t quite fit and eentually, they transform into something else entirely – the cultural package either continues on, is subsumed or merged with another cultural package, or lost.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: With this European Imperial march across the globe, this cultural exchange accelerated to a rate not seen since the height of the Roman Empire – when the import of spices, silks, and other goods needed to sustain a hungry Imperial Rome nearly bankrupted it. Textiles, spices, foodstuffs, and manufactured goods flooded into Europe from abroad. Tea became a fashionable staple. Lush woen carpets and rugs entered many homes. Food traditions were reinented and remixed – today’s English “curry take-away” and the “steam table” restaurants in the Netherlands are direct descendants of this wholesale cultural import.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: In fact, lunch today in the Marenwolf-Brentano house is hummus and naan.
Liza eliz: 🙂
The Doctor: \o/
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Colourful textiles and the cultural garments of the colonial regions had an enourmous impact on the fashions of the Imperial states. Indian pyjama kurta became housecoats, which then became smoking jackets with the rise in popularity of smoking tobacco after the Crimean War in the 1850’s. Smoking jackets and smoking caps (an eolution of the Turkish style of fez) were at their core designed to protect the smoker’s hair and clothes from the byproducts of the act.
The Doctor: Thai curry at the Waydelich residence.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: European textiles themseles were massiely influenced by design from abroad. ictorian textile designers went wild for the bright, colourful forms of Indian ornamentation and translated that into the lush, rich, colourful patterns and paisleys so well known from the era, particularly in wallpapers and upholstery fabrics.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: While the actual fashions of these colonies did not hae a serious impact on mainstream fashion at large, it was not uncommon for Imperial citizens liing in the colonies to “go natie” and keep their adopted cultural stylings when returning to their Imperial homes.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Books and literature were also imported in great numbers. There had always existed a cultural rapport between “West” and “East;” with the rise of the industrialized and affluent Middle Class, this only accelerated and any library worth the name required seeral texts from exotic Silk Road nations. Imperial authors like Rudyard Kipling brought back stories of these lands that opened them to Western audiences like neer before.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Music and dance had less cultural impact during the era, but that has slowly changed in the decades since. Originally, such displays were mostly performed as exhibitions – something to be obsered and not the kind of thing that was easily integrated into the dominant culture. It was seen as unseemly and ulgar. “Cabaret” style belly dance (mostly an Egyptian/Syrian style of dance) was performed in gentlemans’ clubs and in audeille acts; it was a forbidden thrill. In the modern era, belly dance has lost nearly all of its stigma and is openly practiced by women (and some men) the world oer. Cabaret style is still the most popular on the world scale, but a relatiely new fusion style called “American Tribal Style” is increasingly more popular in the United States – and gaining a foothold eerywhere.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Which brings us to Orientalism and how we approach it in SecondLife. The community of Cala Mondrago was formed with the idea of bringing non-Westernized steampunk to the Grid – a “what-if” sort of place that takes the idea of Age of Steam retrofuturism and presses it onto other cultures. What would Istanbul look like with Tesla coils and Aetherhsips? We’e undergone some cultural drift – as all cultures do- but we retain that non-Western idealism.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Perhaps the biggest piece of Orientalism here in SL is the prealence of bellydance as an art form. There are numerous troupes on the Grid and regular performances. It turns up in a number of burlesque performances as well. The performers are paying homage to a classical art form while remixing it into this new digital culture. I think that’s an awesome and powerful thing.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: As we go into the future, it’s important to remember that among eerything else, SL is a place for us to learn and explore. Orientalism has some dark ugliness in its roots, but I think that this platform gies us a place to explore those underpinnings and excise them; we hae the opportunity to sample many different cultures, to see what we hae in common, and hopefully to take those commonalities and help to bring joy and goodness to our worlds.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Wow… apparently, when I get a little nerous, I speechify quickly 🙂 That was much shorter than my (read aloud) practice runs.
Lady Sumoku cleaps too
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: One of the things that has been pointed out to me is that the cultural exchange went both ways – the rise of European fashion in Japan during the Meiji period being one of the best examples
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach applauds
Bookworm Hienrichs laughs and applauds.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: That was slightly outside the scope, so I didn’t mention it in the presenation, but I think it’s worth mentioning.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach eyes Lady Sumoku
Liza eliz: It is
Liza eliz: <<appluads
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: And, thank you all!
Jan: Applause! .)
The Doctor: I noticed turbans seemed to be popular high fashion in 19th Century Europe.
Bookworm Hienrichs: I hope people hae questions!
The Doctor: Would that be an example of this concept?
Erehwon is thinking
Stereo Nacht: I do hae one, albeit maybe too complex…
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: That’s a perfect example, actually.
Erehwon but needs more water, BRB.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Well, bring it out, Captain Nacht and we’ll see if we can tackle it
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Turbans or headwraps were pretty prealent in medieal fashion as early as the 1400s.
Ranma Tardis: so how did China influence the west besides tea?
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Many things fm the British Raj period made their way back from the Indian subcontinent to Mother England and had their day int he soggy London sun
Stereo Nacht: With the rises of accusations of “cultural appropriation”, is there a way, in your opinion, to go get cultural influences while being respectful?
Wulfriðe Blitzen: Well there is the famous Brighton Paillion for instance.
Tepic Harlequin: kedgery!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: The Capitan has asked the question that I hoped someone would hae brought up!
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: In my opinion, a lot of the cries of “cultural appropriation” are based in racism or ignorance – for example, claiming that learning a language not your own or simply eating a food from another culture is appropriation.
Stereo Nacht: Glad to proide! 😉
Tepic Harlequin: mais ca, c;est fou! hehehe
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: That does seem oerly limiting.
Stereo Nacht: Absolument, M. Harlequin! 😉
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: I think the answer is to understand what is sacred and what isn’t, and to listen to members of the actual culture.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: M Tardis, aside from earlier cultural injections like gunpowder, pasta, and tea, China’s influence on “the West” was felt in architecture and textiles.
Liza eliz: adn porceliane?
Lady Sumoku was going to suggest china.
Forgetful Oubliette: I was thinking about textiles, yes.
Wulfriðe Blitzen thinks of brick tea.
Liza eliz: and furnitures
Ranma Tardis: was thinking more culture like the British Empire giing us afternoon tea
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Fans – parasols?
Liza eliz: Opium?
The Doctor: Heheh.
Stereo Nacht: I would beliee that fans hae been deeloped independently in many cultures, but I could be wrong.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Parasols were always sun protection first; who started oiling them against rain?
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: I was thinking specifically of the folding fans.
Erehwon: so, with respect to appropriation, I can make some suggestions?
Andrea Jones: Gien the cost of transportation. How much actual materials in the form of finished products were pulled unnecessarily from their homelands?
Stereo Nacht: I would loe to hear them, Magistrate-Barista! 🙂
Erehwon: first is to listen to people in SL who are from the cultures we are interested in
Tepic Harlequin: china were packed as balast in ships, don;t cost so much as carried that way…
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: An excellent point, Barista. We need to make sure that we’re respecting the cultures as we’re sampling and remixing them.
Erehwon: Chandra Masala of Bilo, who made the kaftan I’m wearing, is Kasmiri/Arabic
Erehwon: one thing she really doesn’t want us, as Westerners doing, is wearing bindi
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: It can be difficult when some people say one thing, and others say another.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Hae the two of you eer discussed Mondrago?
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: I’e seen many people who belong to that culture say that bindis are fine, they are mass-produced fashion.
Erehwon: and I see bindi on sale eerywhere, but it really has a specific cultural/religous role
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: There’s a difference between a tikka and a sticker bindi
Erehwon: and Tehanu, that means we hae to exercise judgement
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Of course.
Stereo Nacht: I understand that bindi is a way for Hindu women to show they hae done their prayer, but I could be wrong.
Erehwon: I don’t want to get into the position of “shopping” for a faorable ruling
Erehwon: nor do we want someone to use their postion to troll
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: There will be as many opinions among another culture on how it should be shared as the ones attempting to enjoy it from the outside.
Tepic Harlequin: ha! whateer yer do, or don’t do, there is always someone will get offended!
Erehwon: but if i want clothing from the region, I look to Chandra and Zaara Kohime
Erehwon: they know what they are doing!
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: The ery fact that we can hae this conersation is, I think, a ery clear sign that we understand the trouble with the original Orientalism – we DO care about such things now.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: And I find that to be completely awesome.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: (15 minutes)
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: As opposed to the wholesale consumption of “quaint” cultures in preious eras, we’re striing to be careful and conscious of how we do it.
Erehwon: another thing we can do is don’t assume all steampunk comes from Europe.
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Well, apart from the negatie racial assumptions about the cultures, Orientalism was just the continuiation of thousands of years of a uniersal human culture. It’s one of the things that makes us human – being intrigued by things that are different.
Stereo Nacht: Anyway. I formally gie all here permissions to use tuques/toques! 😉 (Not that it is really needed!)
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano grins
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: The Chinese had some ery cleer inentors and were not held back by plagues.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: I hate the attitude of “if it’s not ictorian, it’s not Steampunk” that comes up all too frequently. That’s one of the htings I loe about Mondrago – its entire EXISTANCE is non-Western/non-ictorian steampunk and how that might play out.
Erehwon: there’s a loely, but regretfully titled, collection of steampunk short stories edited by JoSelle anderhoof that can gie you ideas for non-western steampunk
Lady Sumoku: I think the complaint is more “ictorian-ERA” related.
Wulfriðe Blitzen: I think the west has been collectiely fascinated with the Orient since the first silks were exported down the Silk Road 2,000 years ago.
Stereo Nacht: Good point Ms. Barista. I recently read two good noels (one good, the other wonderful) with non-European main characters.
Aodhan: My people exported flimsy green plastic top hats and jokes about alcoholism to the ciilised world. You’re welcome.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach chuckles
Liza eliz: lol
Wulfriðe Blitzen smiles
Jimmy Branagh: Oy loikes me green top hat!
Stereo Nacht: Considering beer predates history, you may be giing your people too much credential, M Aodha! X-D
Stereo Nacht: Aodhan (I can’t type today…)
Erehwon: and I’ll plug the iOS game 80 Days again as a great example of that
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Fraulein Barista, what was the name of the story collection?
Aodhan: 😀
Tepic Harlequin: some of the toys an mechanisms from the Ottaman Empire fit steampunk beautifully
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Some brilliant work there, ja.
Stereo Nacht: Agreed, Mr. Harlequin!
Erehwon: okay, I will warn you that the title is salacious and the collection isn’t really eroticia
Erehwon: Steam-Powered: Lesbian Steampunk Stories,
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach chuckles
Erehwon: just that the protagonists in the stories identify as women and many of the stories are set outside of europe
Tepic Harlequin: some in the Mega Steampunk collections on Amazon too….
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Hardly a drawback.
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: One of the things that’s been going through my mind of late is inerting the Imperial Expansion paradigm for steampunk.. what would Jolly Old England look like if India had decided to play empire and landed Gurkhas and Sikhs in Southampton? How would the world hae changed if the Silk Road powers became World powers?
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano grins.
Stereo Nacht: That, Magistrate, is worth a dozen noels at least! 🙂
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Well, I’d really loe a tweed salwar kameez with a plaid dupatta.
The Doctor: I read a short Alternate History story on that.
Liza eliz: well, if we think of today.. China is coming all oer the world…implementing eerything….
The Doctor: “The English Mutiny”
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: To me, one of the powerful things about SL is that here, I CAN explore that in a 3D manner.
The Doctor: About a rebellion in Mughal Britain
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Fascinating.
Tepic Harlequin: probably hae to go back to an earlier fork in history for that….
Erehwon: http://nkjemisin.com/2010/01/a-story-for-haiti-the-effluent-engine/ this is one of the stories from the collection
Ranma Tardis: how about China turning outward not inward?
The Doctor: Ink From a New Moon, Ms. Tardis.
The Doctor: From the same anthology I was reading
Stereo Nacht: Hm. If they had crushed the Mongols, so not build the Great Wall, and started exploring instead?
The Doctor: Persecuted Buddhist separatists leae the Middle Kingdom, sail east across the Pacific Ocean, find a new set of continents
Ranma Tardis: haing roots in the Ryukyu Kingdom hae a different perspectie
The Doctor: Long story short, trading posts become Chinese colonies, rebel, and become the Unified Sandalwood Autocracies, or USA for short.
Stereo Nacht: 😀
Jimmy Branagh: hehe
The Doctor: The western coast being heaily industrialized, the east being mostly wilderness and referred to as the “Eil East”
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach chuckles
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano: Kim Stanley Robinson’s “The Years of Rice and Salt” explores a world where the black plague in Europe had a 95% mortality rate, and the oid was filled by China and the Middle East.
Jimmy Branagh: “Go East, Young Man!”
The Doctor: It’s written in the form of a letter home, with references to a great central rier akin to the Yangzte, and like the Wall back home keeping out the Mongols to the north, a great wall extends across the southern deserts to ward off icious Aztecatl raiding parties.
The Doctor: This is the story talking, of course, not me.
The Doctor: I wasn’t there.
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: We hae about four minutes left before you are all likely to scatter to the four winds. Bitte, if you can, show your appreciation to our fine speaker today before you leae.
Bookworm Hienrichs chuckles.
Lady Sumoku clapsAodhan: Thank you ery much. A most interesting and informatie talk and thought-prooking discussion.
Liza eliz: <<aplausd
Jimmy Branagh applauds
Erehwon: of course you weren’t, Doctor. gies him the “If I catch you messing with time again” look
Liza eliz: applauds* een
Tehanu Marenwolf-Brentano APPLAUDS!!!
Wulfriðe Blitzen Applauds
Aodhan: Thank you, Mr. Marenwolf-Brentano.
Jimmy Branagh: Great Salon, sir!
The Doctor: There is also mention of the natie populations, some interactions less perfect than others, and alot of the tribes conerting to Buddhism.
Jan: Applause, it was ery good to read this all! 🙂
Lucien Marenwolf-Brentano: Thank you all SO MUCH for coming out today! This was a lot of fun, and I hope somewhat educational!
Erehwon: eeryone go read N K Jemisin’s story
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: The transcript will be posted at http://aethersalon.blogspot.com as soon as Fraulein Hienrichs can manage.
Tepic Harlequin: well, gotta go do me rounds, night all!
Jimmy Branagh: Noight Tep!
Aodhan: Goodnight, eeryone.
Liza eliz: nte
Hally Xiang: Good night eeryone
Lady Sumoku waes
Wulfriðe Blitzen waes
Jan: Good night eerybody, take care 🙂
Bookworm Hienrichs: Transcripts, and hopefully pictures, will be posted tomorrow.
Bookworm Hienrichs smiles.
The Doctor: A wonderful discussion!
Bookworm Hienrichs: Do please join us next month, if you can. Noember 16th!
Jimmy Branagh: Oy’m off too. Thenks again Mr. Lucien! Noight awl!
Liza eliz: nite
Jimmy Branagh bows to the Baron and runs off
Baron Klaus Wulfenbach: Danke, Fraulein Bookworm, and gute Nacht, those leaing.